Harvest Numbers For Deer Reported (Non-check station WMAs)

If I had the inside track, I would consider changing my username. By the way I was not singling you out. To get that inside track all you have to do is pick up the phone and call FWC.

joekat it would be a lot easier to phone and ask for this info.

Since you like to hunt turkeys, I just received this form Alabama Wildlife Freshwater Fisheries (WFF). This is just part of the email, but it gives some insite on how some of these wildlife managers feel about what's going on with today's turkey hunters and I'm sure it the same for deer hunters.


"Chuck Sykes, WFF Director, also said this trend in turkey harvest cannot necessarily be construed as an increase in the turkey population.

Sykes said he focused on the first 10 days of the past three seasons to illustrate the increase in hunters compared to turkey harvest numbers. During the opening 10 days of the 2021 season 3,808 hunters reported 4,488 birds harvested. The same time period for the 2022 and 2023 seasons showed significant increases in hunters (6,062 hunters in 2022 and 6,325 in 2023) and a corresponding increase in reported harvests (7,391 in 2022 and 7,845 in 2023).

Sykes said what concerns him is the motivation of today’s turkey hunters compared to previous generations.

“Back in the day, you hunted turkeys for the challenge,” he said. “I’m not saying I didn’t like killing turkeys, but it was different. I don’t see that today. I’m not saying everybody. No matter what rules and regulations we put in place, no matter what science we come up with, we can’t legislate or regulate morals and ethics. Rules and regs are only as good as people who abide by them.”

Sykes said he studied the contacts the WFF Conservation Enforcement Officers had with turkey hunters during the first 10 days of the 2023 season, and it was disheartening.

“The number of citations written was embarrassing,” he said. “More than half the counties had citations written in them.”

Those game violations included hunting without a license, adults hunting during youth weekend, hunting prior to the opening of the season and using decoys the first 10 days of the season.

“But the biggest one was hunting over bait,” Sykes said. “We had more than 80 citations written for hunting by the aid of bait in the first 10 days. If we wrote that many, how many were doing it? I think people’s mindsets have changed to ‘I just want to kill turkey under any circumstance so I can post the picture or video on social media.’

“I hope I’m wrong. It just seems that the lines between right and wrong are very blurred right now.”

Sykes said modern technology has become so sophisticated that the sense of fair chase has been marginalized.

“Like using a cell phone-activated trail camera, not just to scout, but to see a turkey and go try to kill him,” he said. “Back in the day, if a turkey didn’t gobble but once or twice on the limb, he had a good chance of making it. That was a defense mechanism. You might have hunted him all season. Now, with the cell phone-activated trail camera alerting you every time a turkey walks by, whether he gobbles or not, you can still kill him.

“I’m not saying all technology is bad. I’m using a .410 now that shoots better than 12 gauges that I hunted with for 25 years. You’ve got Thermacells and turkey loungers and lightweight guns. We’ve got to take into account that people are much more effective killers. If you throw out the illegal activities, just the legal hunting methods are making people much more effective killers, and I don’t think people are giving that the attention it needs.”

For veteran hunters who remember when the turkey population in Alabama was not abundant, an outing where a hunter heard a turkey gobble was considered a successful hunt.

“It doesn’t seem like that’s the case anymore,” Sykes said. “I think until people respect the bird and love the hunt and love the bird more than they love themselves, the birds are in trouble. People are turkey shooters now, not turkey hunters.

“I didn’t grow up that way, and a lot of people of our generation can’t understand that mentality. That’s what I see. Again, I hope I’m wrong. I will gladly say that I am.”

As far as Turkeys gobbling goes, (I know this starts to go off topic), back in the day the harvest of Hens, although somewhat limited, was way more than the harvest of Hens allowed today. This somewhat parallels with the harvest of Does. Now if a Gobbler has a plethora of Hens around him, he doesnt need to Gobble much to attract them. Similarly, if a Buck has a plethora of Does around him, he doesnt need to travel far to find them. The question I have is, does an overpopulation of Turkey Hens and Does effect the habits of Gobblers and Bucks? The habits we hunters use to find them?

I'm not sure how ensuring a sizable population got conflated with big antlers and long beards. I would agree with creating more opportunities for people to participate in the sport. I'm not sure that shooting more females will fulfill the goal of maximum sustainable harvest. Maybe...maybe not.

This really wasn't the point I was making. Is it worth a lower population to have higher percentages of gobblers gobbling and bucks running around crazy? Personally, I've seen an increase in buck "rut" behavior since the APRs went into effect years ago. The turkey gobbling issue is not due to hens as much as it is predators and pressure IMO.

Regardless, I have a suspicion that legal hunting is not the cause of the majority of population issues. I think more bang for our buck would be found in habitat management, predator management, and dealing with poaching.

It seems all these game managers are more like politicians, use any reason to impose more restrictions. It seems turkey pops are down in some states and they really don't know way. We all know all game pops are cyclic, but now they use these down turns to impose more restrictions. All it takes is a few loud vocal hunters to agree with them.

You certainly live up to your user name.  Lol 

      legal,   public land hunting has almost no effect on populations.        same goes with legal rod and reel fishermen.         hunters and fishermen are just the easy scapegoats who take the blame, deal with the restrictions and lose access all because of piss poor management.

Just pretend them 2023 results are big old double bearded tom just on the other side of a clearing... He's going to come to you but you got wait for it....wait, wait
wait for it....waaaaaait for it...

What are you guys really hoping to gain from all this information that fwc is apparently hiding?

Nothing will beat boots on the ground. Just because a WMA has a good year it has nothing to do with the following year. In fact it may be the opposite, alot of birds killed last year may mean that there will be fewer to hunt this year.

If you are trying computer scout, you need to consider other factors, one being weather conditions at the time of the hunt or maybe burns for land management.

Ok, you win. Do it your way and good luck.

Probably repeating myself but no one should need a reason to see the deer and turkey results from all the WMAs and all the counties in the state. The check in system will ask for the WMA or the county of harvest so it's there. Publish it. I wonder if I need to fill out multiple FOIA request or will one do it. Let you know.